Where is the order from Srila Prabhupada?

DOR = Defeat Of Rocana - - - DOAR = Defeat Of Anti Ritviks

DOR - Defeat Of Rocana

This webpage is dedicated to Rocana das, and his deviations
from Srila Prabhupada's teachings as warning to all sincere devotees.

DOR - Defeat Of Rocana
(BY: A GROUP OF SRILA PRABHUPADA DISCIPLES & FOLLOWERS)

Rocana's deviations start with insulting his own guru, calling Srila Prabhupada a "post mortem", "posthumous", "post samadhi" guru (and other concocted names) declaring Srila Prabhupada for dead and gone. Rocana maintains the wrong idea, that Srila Prabhupada is no longer available for giving guidance and instructions to us, although Srila Prabhupada says quite the opposite, that he is always with us through his books and teachings:

750716pc.sf Conversations
Reporter (2): What will happen to the movement in the United States when you die?
Prabhupada: I WILL NEVER DIE.
Devotees: Jaya! Hari bol! (laughter)
Prabhupada: I SHALL LIVE FROM MY BOOKS, AND YOU WILL UTILIZE.
Reporter (2): Are you training a successor?
Prabhupada: Yes, my Guru Maharaja is there. Where is my photo of Guru Maharaja? I think... Here is.

Indian Lady: ... is that spiritual master still guiding after death?
Srila Prabhupada: Yes, yes. Just like Krsna is guiding us, similarly spiritual master will guide us. (General lectures, 69/09/23)

Devotee: Srila Prabhupada when you're not present with us , how is it possible to receive instructions? For example in questions that may arise...

SRILA PRABHUPADA: Well the questions are answ... answers are there in my books. So utilise whatever time you find to make a thorough study of my books. Then all your questions will be answered. Every one of you must regularly read our books at least twice, in the morning and evening, and automatically all questions will be answered. (Morning Walk, Los Angeles, 13/5/73, various Letters)

If I depart there is no cause for lamentation. I will always be with you through my books and orders. I will always remain with you in that way. (BTG 13:1-2, December 1977) (Living Still in Sound)

Srila Prabhupada: "So although a physical body is not present, the vibration should be accepted as the presence of the Spiritual Master, vibration. What we have heard from the Spiritual Master, that is living."

"I shall remain your personal guidance, physically present or not physically, as I am getting personal guidance from my guru maharaja" (Srila Prabhupada to Tamal Krishna, 14 July 1977)

Srila Prabhupada: "So although a physical body is not present, the vibration should be accepted as the presence of the Spiritual Master, vibration. What we have heard from the Spiritual Master, that is living."

Rocana’s "posthumous guru" idea was mentioned many times by Srila Prabhupada as part of the deviant teachings of the post 1936 Gaudiya Matha in India: Srila Prabhupada: "As soon as it was announced that guru maharaja is dead, I am so advanced I can kill guru and become guru” (Srila Prabhupada 1976).

DOR
Defeat Of Rocana
and his bogus
concocted philosophy

Thus Rocana’s idea, that Srila Prabhupada is the "posthumous guru," is all part of the terminology coined by the GBC’s ideological (siddhanta) leaders, such as the Gaudiya Matha’s deviants (who had homosexual gurus as their Acaryas) and their iskCon followers such as Jayadvaita, Ravindra-swarupa, Bhakti Charu and others. All these devious IskCon GBC’s support the worship of the living homosexual and pedophile guru lineage. Their collective idea is that: at least the deviants we are supporting as gurus are "living." So for the deviants, it is better to worship another "living" deviant than a "a posthumous departed acharya."

It is an incontestable historical fact that their idea of “worship of a living body” (vapuh vada) subsequently lead to worship of homosexuals after 1936 in India. And later, when their “living bodily guru worship” (vapuh vada) was adopted by the GBC in ISKCON it lead to the same thing, worship of homosexual pedophiles and deviants after 1977. This has all been recorded in the public newspapers, and thus this fact has never been contested by the GBC or their supporters such as Narayana Maharaja. Yet notice, they are still very proud of their deviations and will not admit to their glaring mistake, never mind that their “posthumous guru” dogma has lead to weird and dangerous “living guru” cults, and then the mass molesting of thousands of children, murders, horrific publicity, and the curse of a high rate of suicides amongst their molested children victims, and so on and so forth? In other words, they said that you need to worship a living body, which is not found anywhere in the Vedic writings, then they selected deviants as the “living body” one had to worship. Rocana is essentially stating that he is still in league with this group?

Notice: Srila Prabhupada says that these “living guru” thinkers are in actual fact “killing guru” with their bogus ideology, or siddhanta. They are attacking the acharyas not necessarily with physical weapons like guns. So these “guru killers” ideologues are using their words to attack and kill the acharya. “Our guru, oh yes he is the posthumous one, our guru is the dead and gone one.” That means they are “killing their guru” with their ideology. Either that or Rocana seems to be confused right from the beginning? A “Samparaya Acharya” is someone who is very much relevant now, even if he has departed physically. Whereas Rocana’s adopted GBC terminology juxtaposes the “Sampradya Acharya” with his “dead, gone, posthumous, post samadhi diksha guru” ideas. Mind you, their “posthumous guru” terms do not even exist in Vedic culture or any other bona fide religion? Which bona fide religion preaches that “our guru is — the dead one”? These terms are fabricated concoctions coming from the fertile brains of Rocana’s mentors, the GBC, the Gaudiya Matha’s deviants like Sridhara Maharaja, Narayana Maharaja, and others like Bhakti-Charu, Gopal-krsna, Jayapataka, Radhanath and similar other "post mortem" "posthumous" "post samadhi" guru vadis? Where does Srila Prabhupada use their "post mortem" "posthumous" "post samadhi" terms to describe — any — of the acharyas?

Rocana's heavy deviations are so severe that he is openly insulting Srila Prabhupada calling Him a "Ritvikist", "Ritvik-Vadi" and other concocted words, with derogatory meaning. Srila Prabhupadas order of July 9th is completely rejected by Rocana, calling it "Ritvikism".

Srila Prabhupada: “Yes; I shall recommend some of you. After this is settled up, I shall recommend some of you to act as officiating acharyas.”

Tamala Krsna: "Is that called ritvik-acharya?"
Srila Prabhupada: "Ritvik yes."

Srila Prabhupada clearly defined officiating acaryas as ritviks who initiate disciples on behalf of the spiritual master.

Srila Prabhupada: "…continue to become ritvik and act on my behalf." (July 31th)

Ritviks are the priests authorized by the spiritual master or his institution to accept students on behalf of ISKCON and Srila Prabhupada. Srila Prabhupada made this perfectly clear. This understanding of the procedure Prabhupada prescribed is consistent with references to ritviks mentioned in Srila Prabhupada’s books. (Why the ritvik-system is bonafide)

Often devotees (like Rocana and bogus IskCon GBCs) opposed to Srila Prabhupada’s ritvik-system for initiations deliberately use the term “ritvik-vada” for the negative connotation this seems to imply. (For instance, the ideas of the sunyavadas, mayavadas, and advaitavadas are condemned by Vaisnava acaryas.) In truth, the term “vada” has no negative conotation. It refers to a philosophical system. There exists no such philosophy as “ritvik-vada”. Acceptance of a specific procedure for conducting a Vedic ritual in no way constitutes a “vada”, or philosophical system. If someone insists on calling ritvik a “vada”, he could use a more fitting term, such as “Prabhupada-vada.” Devotees of the “ritvik camp” believe that all of Srila Prabhupada’s orders are perfect and should be accepted as such by those who claim to be his disciples — particularly those who are leaders in ISKCON.

The attempt of IskCon bogus GBC gurus to degrade the transcendental Vedic term “rtvijah” or “ritvik” to a derogatory word is one more example of offenses that have entered iskcon due to neglecting Srila Prabhupada’s instructions in this regard. In Vedic culture, a ritvik is an exalted priest. Such priests were often respected as gurus, yet they never pretended to be as good as Lord Hari. By the order of the Acarya, the rtvijah recites the mantras that request the presence of Lord Visnu in the fire of Vedic sacrifice (agni-hotra), and he then makes offerings to the Supreme Lord according to Vedic sastra. The rtvijah performs an exalted function. He is a pure brahmin or Vaisnava who is never concerned about the political correctness or convenience of his stance.

Offensive GBC Resolution against Srila Prabhupada:

Iskcon GBC Resolution 304 states: “Whereas the doctrine that Srila Prabhupada desired to continue to act as diksa-guru after his departure from this world, and did not desire any of his disciples to give diksa, or initiation, in succession after him is an errant philosophical deviation (known as ritvikism); and Whereas ritvikism directly contradicts the principle of parampara.

Srila Prabhupada: "I have selected you among eleven men as ‘rittvik‘ or representative of the acharya, to give initiations, both first and second initiation, on my behalf.” (July 10th)

“…the process for initiation to be followed in the future.” (July 11th)
“…continue to become ritvik and act on my charge.” (July 19th)
“…continue to become ritvik and act on my behalf.” (July 31th)

In these documents we find words such as “continue” and “future” which along with the word “henceforward” all point to the permanency of the ritvik system. There is no statement from Srila Prabhupada that even hints that this system was to terminate on his departure.

Above GBC statement is a direct blasphemy against Srila Prabhupada, for which the GBC collectively will receive their karma und be punished. They all wil go to hell for sure.

Why you "anti-ritvik"-idiots want proof from us concerning the ritvik validity?
It is Srila Prabhupada Himself who establishes the ritvik-system, even in writing:

Srila Prabhupada’s letter July 9th, 1977: "Srila Prabhupada indicated that soon He would appoint some of His senior disciples to act as ritvik – representative of the acarya, for the purpose of performing initiations, both first initiation and second initiation."

Urdhvaga das: "Srila Prabhupada’s ritvik instruction, outlined in His letter of July 9, addressed to all devotees is self- explanatory and anyone can understand it whose brain substance is not contaminated by bogus philosophy preached by Iskcons false successor acaryas, self appointed faggots gurus worshiped in a homosexual paedophile guru lineage. Religious propagandist and pseudo-gurus disguised as devotees exploiting the members and assets of the society, demoniac Kali-yuga disciples."

Srila Prabhupada’s specific instructions for carrying out initiations in Iskcon after his physical disappearance as asked directly of him by his Governing Board Commissioners on May 28, 1977 was that he would soon recommend some of his disciples to act as officiating acaryas or ritviks representatives. In the following week on June 4, 1977 he wrote in his will that Iskcon directors would have to be his duly initiated disciples. This also confirms his no change “henceforward” order sent to all GBCs and temple presidents the following month (July 9, 1977) proclaiming his 11 chosen ritvik representatives that would initiate future disciples on his behalf even after his physical disappearance. These three seperate instructions are Srila Prabhupada’s actual replies to the direct question from his GBC disciples in charge of ISKCON management on how they should carry on initiations. Over the next 4 months until his physical disappearance, Srila Prabhupada never changed these orders either written or spoken.

TO GIVE OUR READERS AN IDEA OF ROCANAS DEVIATIONS, WE HAVE POSTED
RESPECTIVE ARTICLES, SO THAT EVERY ONE CAN SEE THE TRUTH FOR HIMSELF:

All arguments are defeated:
Where is the order from Srila Prabhupada?
Uttama-adhikaris or Uttama-aparadhis?

• Rocana’s and ISK’CONS Bogus Philosophy

• Why is Rocana and others referring to Srila Prabhupada
as the “post mortem” “posthumous” “post samadhi” guru ?

• Rocana’s Church of living Gurus | PADA

• Rocana, Madhudvisa, Staple Talk | Kurma Dasa

• Reply to Rocana Dasa on his COMPLETE
MISUNDERSTANDING of BOTH the Guru and Ritvik Issue

• Please Help! Rocana dasa refused to publish
and accept Srila Prabhupada’s explanation.

• Reply to Rocana dasa’s speculation about
chanting mantras and preaching in South India

• Reply to Rocana / Sampradaya Sun / TDD issue

• Will Rocana Defeat The Ritviks? | Kurma Dasa

• Rocana’s posthumous church of the living dead | PADA

• Rocana Das’ Phantasmagoria | Vidura Das

• Rocana’s desperate attempts |
A response to the Sampradaya Sun

• Guru means bona fide | Rocana Dasa

• Rocana: Recent Departures in the Vaishnava Community

• We await Rocanas Offering in that Regard | Janmastami Das

• DOR – DEFEAT OF ROCANA

• Rocana’s “Sampradaya Sun of the living guru”
still in search for a bona fide spiritual master

• Protection — From Rocana’s Bogus Gurus?

• Rocana Dasa: Perhaps, maybe, missing link…..

• Rocana Dasa&team: We guarantee there will be no
more fallen Diksha-Gurus debasing global Vaishnavism

• Dusyanta dasa’s article — Who is Guru?
(From Rocana’s Sampradaya Sun)

• Rocana dasa: “Meeting with B.V. Narayana
– what’s the Real Story?”

• Rocana’s “Moving Ahead” to Where?

• Update on Rocana Dasa’s Sampradaya Sun

• Rocana on DOM / ISKCON / Ritviks (Sampradaya Sun)

• Rocana das - The Time Has Come - For What?

• Rocana Dasa: A Disciple should be careful
to accept an Uttama-Adhikari as Guru

• Paperback Writers | Rocana Das

• Rocana Das: Behind the Façade of ISKCON Legends

• Rocana and the SAMPRADAYA SUN NEWS (update)

ROCANA REFUSING TO POST REBUTTALS

Amar Puri: One can read and understand from ROCANA's replies -- how he is appreciative to Yasodanandana Prabhu’s writing and yet, he appears very envious when he says in his writing; "... he should get free from the mood that he adopted back then, which is reflected in his recent article."

Read: "let me tell you how it is, let me give you the absolute truth, my assertions are un-debatable, I speak only the absolute facts, Srila Prabhupada liked it and approved of it, the better off he'll be to himself and to the rest of us." Without proving any thing wrong, Rocana humbly suggests things contrary to the writing of Yasodananadana Prabhu, which is really not very humble at all and is full of ENVY.

Is that NOT a FACT ?

That is Rocana dasa’s character.

To tell you readers the truth, I used to admire Rocana dasa very much until he put up his thesis "DOR" in his public domain on the net, without allowing anyone to counter his article. After reading it, I began to see different colors in his character, and through his writing he duly twisted and turned against the Rtvik system made by Srila Prabhupada for continued initiation. Rocana never tells us what really was ordered? Stopping the orders of Srila Prabhupada is also -- not an order in itself? What was the order? Rocana never says?

When asked these questions by myself and many others, he will not publish us in order for the public to read and make a well informed decision. Which is what the GBC gurus are doing, And yet he continues promoting and protecting his non-sense ideas, full of concoction interpreted thesis of his DOR, to "prove" HOW wrong Srila Prabhupada's orders are, even saying the orders of the acharya are against the Sastras, Sadhu and Guru tattva. Srila Prabhupada’s Rtvik system of Initiation is what Srila Prabhupada strongly implemented in his Iskcon institution to continue …… HENCEFORWARD ……. as per Srila Prabhupada’s directions.

What any body can do is simply follow Srila Prabhupada’s Instructions -- VANI in order to make our lives sublime in cultivating KC. Anyway, Rocana will never go far saying that Srila Prabhupada's instructions are against guru, sadhu and shastra, that is what the Gaudiya Matha said about Srila Prabhupada, and they did not go far either. They were the branch of the tree of Mahaprabhu that withered, just as Rocana's program is now.

Hari BOL. OM TAT SAT.
All Glories to Srila Prabhupada.

COMMENT BY PADA
[Correct, Rocana does not allow any siddhanta comments from the many writers who have wrote articles to defeat his articles, including some from Amar Puri, various Bangalore devotees, Yasodananda, PADA, Praghosha das, Mahesh Raja, the IRM and many others.

Rocana claims to have an open and honest brahminical siddhanta site, but there is no discussion allowed contrary to what he himself accepts. And of course Rocana only accepts the GBC / Sridhara Maharaja idea that -- there has to be a living guru, which Srila Prabhupada says destroyed the Gaudiya Matha.

There is also no one named "Shasta Chaksus das," rather this is Rocana writing under a pen name. In any case, there are now numbers of sites that are defeating the Rocana / GBC / Sridhara Maharaja "living guru" idea. ys pd]

DOAR - Defeat Of Anti Ritviks

All Arguments defeated:
http://www.iskcon-truth.com/official-documents.html

DOAR - Defeat Of Anti Ritviks
(BY: A GROUP OF SRILA PRABHUPADA DISCIPLES & FOLLOWERS)

Anti-Ritviks are all those so called devotees who oppose Srila Prabhupada's instruction outlined in his July 9th directive and issued to all Temple Presidents and GBC's. Anti-Ritviks dont accept Srila Prabhupada Ritvik-Initiation-System.

There’s abundant evidence such as the May 28th tape, the last will and testament, Srila Prabhupada's Direction Of Management [DOM], the July 9th letter and other documents. There is no doubt that Prabhupada wanted his ritvik system of initiation to be the mechanism of disciplic succession in ISKCON after his departure.

DOAR
Defeat Of Anti Ritviks
and all their bogus
concocted philosophy

The GBC have always argued that the reason we must support their bogus Guru program and thereby reject Srila Prabhupada, is because they offer us a 'living, physical' Guru, and that such a 'living' guru is an absolute necessity due to the nature of the Diksa Guru-Disciple interaction. There are certain functions present in the Guru-Disciple relationship that only a 'living' Diksa Guru can fulfil, they argue. (The "Living Guru" Concoction)

Srila Prabhupada: "So although a physical body is not present, the vibration should be accepted as the presence of the Spiritual Master, vibration. What we have heard from the Spiritual Master, that is living." (Lecture, January 13th, 1969)

It has been argued by the GBC that in order to fulfil these responsibilities within a Guru-Disciple relationship, the Diksa Guru needs to be 'living'. For instance one needs a 'living, physically present' Guru to give the disciple personal instructions for his service, or to instruct him in his spiritual life and answer his questions etc. etc. And therefore it is not possible to accept Srila Prabhupada as our Diksa Guru, since he is not 'living'. However let us now see what the GBC resolutions actually state regarding how these functions should be carried out within a Guru-Disciple relationship, and whether they do actually require a 'living, physically present' Guru. (Strategies and Concoctions of Bogus Gurus Revealed)

In some of the GBC resolutions, the GBC are amaisingly writing that there is no necessity for having a Diksa Guru who is 'living and physically present', since Srila Prabhupada is actually a better alternative!

"ISKCON's founder-acarya, Srila Prabhupada, is the pre-eminent and compulsory siksa-guru for all vaisnavas (gurus and disciples) in the Society, who may directly receive empowerment from him through allegiance to his teachings." (No. 409, 1999 GBC Resolutions)

"Srila Prabhupada's instructions are the essential teachings for every ISKCON devotee." (Resolution 35, Founder-Acarya Statement, 1994)

"ISKCON leaders shall teach that Srila Prabhupada's books and teachings are the foundation of the spiritual lives of all ISKCON members. Therefore, all ISKCON members shall consider it their compulsory duty to study Srila Prabhupada's books. Hearing from other devotee's books and teachings is secondary and supplemental and should not be done at the expense of hearing regularly from Srila Prabhupada." (Law 405 (F), GBC Resolutions, 1999)

"A duly initiated disciple in ISKCON can accept Srila Prabhupada, the founder-acarya of ISKCON, as his principle siksa-guru. During his devotional life, he may experience that he derives more spiritual inspiration from Srila Prabhupada's books and vani than from his own diksa-guru." (Law 601, 2000 GBC Resolutions)

"As it is enjoined in scripture that a devotee must honor his spiritual master, ISKCON members shall be trained to place their faith, trust and allegiance first and foremost in the Founder-Acarya who is the pre-eminent siksa guru for every member of ISKCON." (Law 405, 1999, GBC Resolutions)

There is NO WHERE it says the spiritual master has to be PHYSICALLY PRESENT TO SERVE HIM. One can serve the spiritual master in his ABSENCE how? If there is no chance to serve the spiritual master directly, a devotee should serve him by remembering his instructions. THIS is WHY “In his absence, therefore, his words of direction should be the pride of the disciple.” To us Prabhupadanugas we can SERVE Srila Prabhupada, our BONAFIDE DIKSHA GURU simply by REMEMBERING HIS INSTRUCTIONS.

The Spiritual Masters: CC Adi 1.35 PURPORT
"The service of the spiritual master is essential. If there is no chance to serve the spiritual master directly, a devotee should serve him by remembering his instructions. There is no difference between the spiritual master’s instructions and the spiritual master himself. In his absence, therefore, his words of direction should be the pride of the disciple."

Inquiry: What’s the problem? Devotees go to do VYASA PUJA every YEAR before the Deity of Srila Prabhupada RECITING TO SRILA PRABHUPADA. The same deity is there for us to inquire AND his BOOKS give the ANSWERS. The words nara-matir are appropriate - this means HELLISH MENTALITY the ANTI RITVIK CROOKS CANNOT ACCEPT SRILA PRABHUAPDA DEITY, their mentality IS HELLISH. They make a SHOW BOTTLE recitation of VYASA PUJA whereas WE PRABHUPADANUGAS WORSHIP THE DEITY.

The reason that this ANTI RITVIK BUNCH OF CROOKS cannot grasp that Srila Prabhupada is LIVING IN SOUND -- HIS WORDS is because they consider their GOD is MONEY they SCREW OUT OF THE SYSTEM AND THIS IS WHY THEY WANT THE DEMONIAC ASSES VOTED BY BOGUS GBC WORSHIPED “AS GOOD AS GOD.”

Note: Srila Prabhupada is LIVING IN SOUND:
"So although a physical body is not present, the vibration should be accepted as the presence of the spiritual master, vibration. What we have heard from the spiritual master, that is living."

• What is a Ritvik? – Is ‘RTVIK’ an invented term?

• The Ritvik system is bona fide

• Why the Ritvik system is bonafide

• The "Living Guru" Concoction

• Strategies and Concoctions of Bogus Gurus Revealed

• Ritvik – **Representative**

• Ritvik Acarya or Diksa Guru?

• Srila Prabhupada v. The Ritviks | IRM

• GBC’s Ritvik Philosophy | IRM

• Ritvik Supported In Other Letters | Kurma Dasa

• Process of 1st and 2nd Initiations in ISKCON

• “Srila Prabhupada established a Ritvik System”